I'm pretty sure that "We're all socialists now" was the name of an article that ran in Time or Newsweek a month or so ago. Never read it myself, but then again neither did any of the right-wing types who immediately sprang into action. In those quarters, it was interpreted as some sort of rallying cry ("Hooray! We're all socialists now!"), but I've heard that it was much more alarmist ("OMG! We're all socialists now!!!1!). You know - Obama's popular, Obama's a socialist, therefore...
To summarize, the Tinsley thought process: "'We're All Socialists Now' TL;DR but it MUST be more MSM treason! LET'S RUN THAT SHIZNIT!"
I'm not quite sure Mallard grasps what socialism is.
Anyways, the United States will never be socialist. Obama is not moving it in that direction. Portugal is the only socialist country in Europe, contrary to popular US belief. Places like France and Sweden have socialist-like systems for certain sectors like health care and education, but remain largely free-market, a concept lost on the people who make Pavlov proud when they hear the S-word.
You know what's fun? https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/docs/rankorderguide.html Playing "find the US" with those lists.
I have insurance, but thanks for refusing to pay for me anyways. Like most liberals, I do have money, an education, and the ability and desire to be consistently employed. I'm also healthy and currently pay more into the system of private insurance than I get out of it. I pay about the same amount as those in other countries pay in taxes for the nationalized health care.
The idea has nothing to do with entitlement, it's that if I'm going to pay anyways for insurance where it's in excess, maybe it could go as a safety net for that 9% of Americans who are employed but uninsured instead of profit for private companies. I don't worry much about the outliers taking advantage of it (besides, what exactly are they going to do, demand chemo every week?) because I'm just not spiteful.
"I care for myself, I do not want to buy insurance for you."
Well, then you're incredibly fortunate that you don't have a genetic disorder or a "pre-existing" condition waiting to bankrupt you at any moment. (Reminds me of the guy who was a hard-core libertarian until his daughter was born with a serious heart defect. If he hadn't been lucky enough - and it was just a matter of luck - to have insurance that covered the resulting surgeries, it would have ruined their entire family financially, through no fault of their own.)
As a liberal, I don't want universal health insurance because I think everyone is "entitled" to it. I want universal health insurance because it will be cheaper and more effective than the current system where insurance companies can take your money and then yank your coverage if you actually need it.
Further reading: http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1883149-1,00.html
Mr. Anonymous - i'm so happy that you get to have health insurance. why do you think that those without insurance don't care for themselves? i don't have insurance and it is for two reasons. number one: i can't buy private health insurance because of a pre-existing condition, even though it is not currently active. number two: i can't afford it. i don't have enough money to pay for it and i'm not poor enough to get state or federal aid.
but do you know what? i'm lucky enough to be a Canadian citizen as well as an American. that means that i can move to Canada and enjoy the free health care that is the right of every Canadian citizen. And don't try the argument that Canadian hospitals make everyone wait for hours on end. it isn't true, if you need to be treated, you will be treated. and don't try to tell me that Canadians pay higher taxes, they don't. my brother moved there a few years ago and he pays less in taxes than he would if he lived in the U.S. and he gets more services for that money.
the moral of the story: nationalized healthcare can and does work, Americans are just too stupid and paranoid to give it a try.
The message of this comic is clear: if we accept Obama's ebil socialist program, we will be jerked out of our houses, beaten to death on a rock, gutted, filleted, and eaten by fat tourists. Clear as mud.
I wonder if Anonymous realizes who DOES pick up the tab for indigent patients in emergency rooms? That's right, taxpayers. In ADDITION, the taxpayers probably pay considerably MORE for such patients than they would if there were national health insurance because (1) it costs more to deliver care in an emergency-room setting, and (2) ERs don't provide preventive care.
"I Pay for my health insurance; why should I pay for YOURS?"
I do not think you understand how insurance works. You pay for your health insurance, eh? Guess what, spanky? You're ALREADY paying for other people's health care.
You see, the whole concept of insurance is that every one pays into it, with the hope that the other guy is the one that needs it. Let's say every medical procedure costs $10,000. Well, for one person, that's a non-affordable expense. So, you go to the insurance company with nine of your friends, and say, "say, we'll give you $1,000 each, and if one of us ever needs a procedure done, you'll pay for the bulk of it." So you get sick and need that procedure; you pay $3,000 out of your pocket on the spot, the insurer pays the rest. And where did that 'rest' come from? The other nine people. They just paid for your health care.
The argument about not paying for others, aside from being specious as was pointed out earlier, is also a problem for other reasons. National epidemics of a natural or unnatural type (IE weaponized diseases) are going to usually have their flash point be among the impoverished. Both because of proximity level and inability to afford seeing a physician when the disease is still in a theoretically manageable form. Study things like the black plague, the spanish influenza, these things were capable of tearing huge chunks of a population out.
I could also point out the fact that while I am fairly lucky in my health insurance the business model it is designed as is frankly abusive. You essentially put in money praying you never have to use it, and then the moment you do you not only risk losing your coverage but also higher premiums if you keep it as well as their trying to justify non-payment for the treatments using any legal loophole they can. When they are functionally holding a persons life in their hands it's not only a problem if they refuse it can literally cost a life.
Long term care, like medication, can't be gotten in an emergency room. I am also unlikely to receive proper rehabilitation training if I have an injury that might have rendered me disabled for an extended period without insurance. Yeah, a gunshot victim, rape victim, heart attack or stroke victim is only going to get a large bill. But if a person needs extended care due to the nature of their ailment..well sucks to be them.
Life might not be fair, nature might be arbitrary and capricious, but that doesn't excuse human cruelty or callousness.
15 comments:
I'm pretty sure that "We're all socialists now" was the name of an article that ran in Time or Newsweek a month or so ago. Never read it myself, but then again neither did any of the right-wing types who immediately sprang into action. In those quarters, it was interpreted as some sort of rallying cry ("Hooray! We're all socialists now!"), but I've heard that it was much more alarmist ("OMG! We're all socialists now!!!1!). You know - Obama's popular, Obama's a socialist, therefore...
To summarize, the Tinsley thought process: "'We're All Socialists Now' TL;DR but it MUST be more MSM treason! LET'S RUN THAT SHIZNIT!"
That's right, America; a man who does about 10 minutes worth of work each day is accusing you of being lazy and stupid for wanting health care.
I'm not quite sure Mallard grasps what socialism is.
Anyways, the United States will never be socialist. Obama is not moving it in that direction. Portugal is the only socialist country in Europe, contrary to popular US belief. Places like France and Sweden have socialist-like systems for certain sectors like health care and education, but remain largely free-market, a concept lost on the people who make Pavlov proud when they hear the S-word.
You know what's fun?
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/docs/rankorderguide.html
Playing "find the US" with those lists.
Remember, according to the average US Citizen:
Fascism = Atheism = Communism = Socialism = Puppy kicking = Not arresting poor people for being poor
Wow. Now a whole freakin' straw ocean.
BakaHoushi nailed it!
WV:dimpes - people who think like Tinkley
Anon 1:37 a.m.
If you want health care go to almost any hospital ER and you will be cared for.
If you want health insurance for yourself or your family purchase it. I care for myself, I do not want to buy insurance for you.
You are not entitled to free health insurance because you live in this country. Sadly, most liberals disagree.
Today's comic makes a lot of sense.
Iceland, which abandoned its fishing industry to build an Ann-Rand-style unregulated financial market, is collapsing as such things always do.
In contrast, the Norwegians are great fishermen and, compared to our United States, relatively socialist (...although not in an absolute sense.)
So who is suffering? THE FISH!!!
Mallard Fillmore has given up on humanity and is advocating for animals now.
I have insurance, but thanks for refusing to pay for me anyways. Like most liberals, I do have money, an education, and the ability and desire to be consistently employed. I'm also healthy and currently pay more into the system of private insurance than I get out of it. I pay about the same amount as those in other countries pay in taxes for the nationalized health care.
The idea has nothing to do with entitlement, it's that if I'm going to pay anyways for insurance where it's in excess, maybe it could go as a safety net for that 9% of Americans who are employed but uninsured instead of profit for private companies. I don't worry much about the outliers taking advantage of it (besides, what exactly are they going to do, demand chemo every week?) because I'm just not spiteful.
"I care for myself, I do not want to buy insurance for you."
Well, then you're incredibly fortunate that you don't have a genetic disorder or a "pre-existing" condition waiting to bankrupt you at any moment. (Reminds me of the guy who was a hard-core libertarian until his daughter was born with a serious heart defect. If he hadn't been lucky enough - and it was just a matter of luck - to have insurance that covered the resulting surgeries, it would have ruined their entire family financially, through no fault of their own.)
As a liberal, I don't want universal health insurance because I think everyone is "entitled" to it. I want universal health insurance because it will be cheaper and more effective than the current system where insurance companies can take your money and then yank your coverage if you actually need it.
Further reading:
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1883149-1,00.html
Mr. Anonymous - i'm so happy that you get to have health insurance. why do you think that those without insurance don't care for themselves? i don't have insurance and it is for two reasons. number one: i can't buy private health insurance because of a pre-existing condition, even though it is not currently active. number two: i can't afford it. i don't have enough money to pay for it and i'm not poor enough to get state or federal aid.
but do you know what? i'm lucky enough to be a Canadian citizen as well as an American. that means that i can move to Canada and enjoy the free health care that is the right of every Canadian citizen. And don't try the argument that Canadian hospitals make everyone wait for hours on end. it isn't true, if you need to be treated, you will be treated. and don't try to tell me that Canadians pay higher taxes, they don't. my brother moved there a few years ago and he pays less in taxes than he would if he lived in the U.S. and he gets more services for that money.
the moral of the story: nationalized healthcare can and does work, Americans are just too stupid and paranoid to give it a try.
The message of this comic is clear: if we accept Obama's ebil socialist program, we will be jerked out of our houses, beaten to death on a rock, gutted, filleted, and eaten by fat tourists. Clear as mud.
I wonder if Anonymous realizes who DOES pick up the tab for indigent patients in emergency rooms?
That's right, taxpayers.
In ADDITION, the taxpayers probably pay considerably MORE for such patients than they would if there were national health insurance because (1) it costs more to deliver care in an emergency-room setting, and (2) ERs don't provide preventive care.
Republican False Economy strikes again!
"I Pay for my health insurance; why should I pay for YOURS?"
I do not think you understand how insurance works.
You pay for your health insurance, eh? Guess what, spanky? You're ALREADY paying for other people's health care.
You see, the whole concept of insurance is that every one pays into it, with the hope that the other guy is the one that needs it.
Let's say every medical procedure costs $10,000. Well, for one person, that's a non-affordable expense. So, you go to the insurance company with nine of your friends, and say, "say, we'll give you $1,000 each, and if one of us ever needs a procedure done, you'll pay for the bulk of it." So you get sick and need that procedure; you pay $3,000 out of your pocket on the spot, the insurer pays the rest.
And where did that 'rest' come from?
The other nine people. They just paid for your health care.
Real Life 101. Test on Wednesday.
The argument about not paying for others, aside from being specious as was pointed out earlier, is also a problem for other reasons. National epidemics of a natural or unnatural type (IE weaponized diseases) are going to usually have their flash point be among the impoverished. Both because of proximity level and inability to afford seeing a physician when the disease is still in a theoretically manageable form. Study things like the black plague, the spanish influenza, these things were capable of tearing huge chunks of a population out.
I could also point out the fact that while I am fairly lucky in my health insurance the business model it is designed as is frankly abusive. You essentially put in money praying you never have to use it, and then the moment you do you not only risk losing your coverage but also higher premiums if you keep it as well as their trying to justify non-payment for the treatments using any legal loophole they can. When they are functionally holding a persons life in their hands it's not only a problem if they refuse it can literally cost a life.
Long term care, like medication, can't be gotten in an emergency room. I am also unlikely to receive proper rehabilitation training if I have an injury that might have rendered me disabled for an extended period without insurance. Yeah, a gunshot victim, rape victim, heart attack or stroke victim is only going to get a large bill. But if a person needs extended care due to the nature of their ailment..well sucks to be them.
Life might not be fair, nature might be arbitrary and capricious, but that doesn't excuse human cruelty or callousness.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day; teach a man to fish and OMG YOU'RE RUNNING A COMMUNIST MADRASSA AND YOU HATE HARD WORK AND AMERICA
captcha: "uales", which I read as "micro-ales", of which Bruce has to drink 1000x as many to blow his usual breathalyzer reading.
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